still not ecstatic about low-end acceleration

10477 Views 13 Replies 7 Participants Last post by stzombie, Apr 21, 2016

jsyteng

Discussion Starter · Jan 22, 2016 (Edited)

I've had the car for 3 weeks now and am generally happy with it, although it's taken quite a while to understand how the technology works and some of its associated quirks.

One thing, however, I'm still trying to better understand and accept: clumsy, sluggish, and uneven low-end acceleration.

I drive it almost exclusively in S mode, esp. in the city, with the understanding that fuel economy might take a hit. However, I still notice that when I am coming out of a turn, the engine almost sounds/feels like it's turning off, then as I continue to push down on the pedal the acceleration kicks in and I lurch forward.

I notice that might be happening more when I have Max Defrost on and the engine is cold. I experience this regularly when I hop into the car first thing in the morning.

I have been very mindful about pushing down on the pedal very evenly and not mashing, and it still seems to do this. I'm wondering if I using gear paddles will help more . . .

thoughts?

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LRDSnTexas

· #2 · Jan 26, 2016

Adaptive Transmission

You need to read my post here: http://www.discoverysport.net/forum/introductions/4241-howdy.html

Bottom line is that it ain't great but it will get somewhat better. Just drive the car, it will learn. Don't try to adjust your driving to the car, that actually seems to make things worse. That said I still have the issue at 21k miles so I don't think my transmission is a baby any more. Maybe we are going through an adolescent phase? However I have also had an intermittent fault in the rear differential - this low end stuff really sucks when the brainiac in the car turns off all-wheel drive. Car has been in the shop since 11-Jan waiting on the part...

:crying:

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mkzhang

· #3 · Jan 26, 2016

I think this is more of a symptom of a low tq engine when out of boost... having a manual car gives me a pretty good idea when approaching certain turns I know I will in a weak part of the tq curve so I give it more gas than usual to compensate.

If it helps, not even the best transmission software can solve for this, because there is no way for the car to know you are slowing down to stop, or making a sharp turn onto a faster road / up hill situation so it will need to hold the gear for you. If it held the gear all the time you will be stopping at light with a more engine braking than desired etc.

The only real solution to this is have an engine with broad torque curve, such as a naturally aspirated, low revving v8 (or larger), or the same kind twin scroll turbo engines like BMW

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4sallypat

· #4 · Jan 26, 2016

It's definitely a combination of understanding how a turbo & tranny works:

First, it's not a supercharged RR so let's get that out the of way. It's a turbocharger that requires exhaust gas turbine pressure to get the turbo to kick in.

Second it's a Ford Ecoboost 2L engine so it's like trying to learn how to drive that new Ford F150 pickup truck with the same engine.

Third, the engine needs a higher RPM it engage and the transmission to adapt.

Just like LRDSnTexas said - don't let the car dictate how you drive because then it will drive like a slug.

Drive in S mode (starts in first gear), rev the engine gradually ( don't mash the accelerator), then drive aggressive from the start line every time so that it learns and adapts to your driving style.
You will know you are driving aggressively when the auto start/stop does not activate but stays on at stop lights....

This is much like the BMWs I have had - if you drive it like a novice then it will treat you like a slug. Drive it like you mean it!

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ddogg227

· #5 · Jan 26, 2016

4sallypat said:
It's definitely a combination of understanding how a turbo & tranny works:

First, it's not a supercharged RR so let's get that out the of way. It's a turbocharger that requires exhaust gas turbine pressure to get the turbo to kick in.

Second it's a Ford Ecoboost 2L engine so it's like trying to learn how to drive that new Ford F150 pickup truck with the same engine.

Third, the engine needs a higher RPM it engage and the transmission to adapt.

Just like LRDSnTexas said - don't let the car dictate how you drive because then it will drive like a slug.

Drive in S mode (starts in first gear), rev the engine gradually ( don't mash the accelerator), then drive aggressive from the start line every time so that it learns and adapts to your driving style.
You will know you are driving aggressively when the auto start/stop does not activate but stays on at stop lights....

This is much like the BMWs I have had - if you drive it like a novice then it will treat you like a slug. Drive it like you mean it!

this is incredibly valuable information nobody has told me as a new owner. only available of these forums!

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disco808

· #6 · Jan 26, 2016

Interesting info 4sally. I didn't know you can deactivate the auto on/off if you drive aggressively. Gotta try.

Back to the original topic, a quick fix for the low end acceleration pickup can be as simple as installing a power pedal module. There are many brands out there but they pretty much all do the same - increase throttle response (do not gain horse power). They cost about 300-350. It's like having additional sport modes.

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4sallypat

· #7 · Jan 27, 2016

disco808 said:
Interesting info 4sally. I didn't know you can deactivate the auto on/off if you drive aggressively. Gotta try.

....

Yes, try driving aggressively with high RPMs and you will find that when you come to a stop, the engine will not shut off as it would normally.
Apparently the car is waiting to see if the aggressive driving will continue and keeps the engine running.

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jsyteng

Discussion Starter · #8 · Jan 30, 2016

Thanks for all the insight. This is all epiphanic to me. I had no idea that that the car could "adapt" to how you drive and as a result perform better.

I also didn't know up until recently that Auto Stop/Start will only work based on certain driving conditions (which I've confirmed after visiting the dealer and re-reading the owners manual). As a result, Driver Exit is also dependent on this.

I still don't know how I feel about this. I would figure if you have it enabled, you would want it to work all the time. The fact that it only sometimes works is really lost on me. I want the experience to be consistent, especially regarding Driver Exit.

The dealer says Driver Exit (and I suppose by extension Auto Stop/Start) is only enabled when in "Eco Mode". I think there must be some confusion here. To me, Eco mode is when you have pushed the Eco button next to the Auto Stop/Start button. Sounds like the dealer, on the other hand, refers to it in the context of how you are driving (in other words, NOT aggressive = Eco mode). I might circle back with them for more clarification.

In any event, I am leaning towards turning off Auto Stop/Start each time I start up the engine. Extra step, to be sure, but it eliminates all the guesswork that I described above.

on a different note, I went to the dealer to get a few issues addressed, which thankfully looked like they are resolved. These have all be thoroughly discussed on other threads:

1) fuel gauge issue
2) squeak coming from right side of rear seat
3) SD card error

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4sallypat

· #9 · Jan 31, 2016

jsyteng said:
Thanks for all the insight. This is all epiphanic to me. I had no idea that that the car could "adapt" to how you drive and as a result perform better.

I also didn't know up until recently that Auto Stop/Start will only work based on certain driving conditions (which I've confirmed after visiting the dealer and re-reading the owners manual). As a result, Driver Exit is also dependent on this.

I still don't know how I feel about this. I would figure if you have it enabled, you would want it to work all the time. The fact that it only sometimes works is really lost on me. I want the experience to be consistent, especially regarding Driver Exit.

The dealer says Driver Exit (and I suppose by extension Auto Stop/Start) is only enabled when in "Eco Mode". I think there must be some confusion here. To me, Eco mode is when you have pushed the Eco button next to the Auto Stop/Start button. Sounds like the dealer, on the other hand, refers to it in the context of how you are driving (in other words, NOT aggressive = Eco mode). I might circle back with them for more clarification.

In any event, I am leaning towards turning off Auto Stop/Start each time I start up the engine. Extra step, to be sure, but it eliminates all the guesswork that I described above.

on a different note, I went to the dealer to get a few issues addressed, which thankfully looked like they are resolved. These have all be thoroughly discussed on other threads:

1) fuel gauge issue
2) squeak coming from right side of rear seat
3) SD card error

Yes, the new cars these days have adaptive transmission electronics that "records" how you drive and adapts the transmission to select shift points.

All the past BMWs I have had all had adaptive transmissions that may need to be "flashed to the beginning" so that it can "unlearn" the way you have been driving in the past and learn a "new driver" style.

As for Auto Start Stop - it can be disabled by disconnecting the second auxillary battery - check out the Discovery forum in the UK....

Your 3 issues are definitely on my list too....

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mkzhang

· #10 · Jan 31, 2016

When I had my old lexus, I drove like a grandpa so the car early shifts all the time with sluggish throttle response. Every time I got an oil change and they resets the ECU, it felt like I was driving a new car lol

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jsyteng

Discussion Starter · #11 · Feb 1, 2016

4sallypat said:
Yes, the new cars these days have adaptive transmission electronics that "records" how you drive and adapts the transmission to select shift points.

All the past BMWs I have had all had adaptive transmissions that may need to be "flashed to the beginning" so that it can "unlearn" the way you have been driving in the past and learn a "new driver" style.

As for Auto Start Stop - it can be disabled by disconnecting the second auxillary battery - check out the Discovery forum in the UK....

Your 3 issues are definitely on my list too....

4sallyPat: have you always had the SD card error issue? Mine seems to have returned (although less frequently, and only on engine startup . . still very frustrating)

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4sallypat

· #12 · Feb 1, 2016

Yes the SD card error after starting up happens about once or every other day.
Sometimes I just ignore it and the NAV, SAT returns to normal.....

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LRDSnTexas

· #13 · Apr 20, 2016

Update: at 28k miles me and my "adaptive" transmission have seemed to make peace. Not ideal but way better... Tolerable at least. Best of luck with yours!

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stzombie

· #14 · Apr 21, 2016

I'm only at around 4K and I'm already noticing a difference... Still doesn't feel as "springy" as my F-150 with ecoboost (surprisingly), but the DS has definitely refined its get up and go from when I just picked it up. No complaints whatsoever...

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